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| Full house with whole house? |
House systems are one of the weak sides of astrology, IMO. I never think much about houses. In this post however, I am thinking about them. Just thinking...? No, I also try to check a few things. Like:
A. Is it the 2nd house or the 11th house that indicates possible wealth?
B. Is it the Placidus system or the whole sign house system that connects the 2nd and 11th house with the 10th house (and NOT the 12th) in the charts of those who became rich?
C. DOES a chart indicate wealth at all?
That is a lot to think about, especially because I am not very fond of house systems and if I can avoid houses, I will, though sometimes I mention them. This aversion against houses started with the meaning of Saturn in my 7th house (Placidus), while I married young and am still married and my husband is my age. I know that assumptions like getting married late or marrying a person with age difference or more/less status are not used in modern astrology (the 'political correct' astrology), but this idea still lives and can be found on websites, too. In the Porphyry house system, Saturn moves to the 8th house. What system should I use?
And what house ruler? The ancient rulers (Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn) in modern times have to share their rulership with Uranus, Neptune and Pluto. Meanwhile Libra-Taurus and Gemini-Virgo still have to share their ruler. Also, Cancer's ruler is the Moon (a satellite instead of a planet). It is so very confusing, and it makes such a difference!
Picture this: my house ruler 1 might be Jupiter in 12 or in 1. It might also be Neptune in 7 or in 8. So I have 1/3 of the 12 houses as an option! Now who am I? Am I a typical 1 in 7, a 1 in 8, a 1 in1 or a 1 in 12 person? And how about the other house rulers? The differences between Placidus, Porphyry and Whole-sign are amazing! And I haven't even tried to other systems!
A. Is it the 2nd house or the 11th house that indicates possible wealth?
B. Is it the Placidus system or the whole sign house system that connects the 2nd and 11th house with the 10th house (and NOT the 12th) in the charts of those who became rich?
C. DOES a chart indicate wealth at all?
That is a lot to think about, especially because I am not very fond of house systems and if I can avoid houses, I will, though sometimes I mention them. This aversion against houses started with the meaning of Saturn in my 7th house (Placidus), while I married young and am still married and my husband is my age. I know that assumptions like getting married late or marrying a person with age difference or more/less status are not used in modern astrology (the 'political correct' astrology), but this idea still lives and can be found on websites, too. In the Porphyry house system, Saturn moves to the 8th house. What system should I use?
And what house ruler? The ancient rulers (Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn) in modern times have to share their rulership with Uranus, Neptune and Pluto. Meanwhile Libra-Taurus and Gemini-Virgo still have to share their ruler. Also, Cancer's ruler is the Moon (a satellite instead of a planet). It is so very confusing, and it makes such a difference!
Picture this: my house ruler 1 might be Jupiter in 12 or in 1. It might also be Neptune in 7 or in 8. So I have 1/3 of the 12 houses as an option! Now who am I? Am I a typical 1 in 7, a 1 in 8, a 1 in1 or a 1 in 12 person? And how about the other house rulers? The differences between Placidus, Porphyry and Whole-sign are amazing! And I haven't even tried to other systems!
And that is bad, because lots of people tend to connect 'fate' to positions in houses. If that assumption is correct, there can only be one correct system or you go the wrong way!:)
There are astrologers who use rulership placements to define if someone will or will not get children, be rich and famous, get a wedding party one day or be in jail, regardless of their social circumstances. The 12th house, in their opinion, is a bad house and ruler 10 in 12 doesn't help you to become rich and famous. Ruler 10 in 2 is so much better, they say. It is also important to have planets in the second house. Let me test this '10-2 12-2' idea.
Donald Trump is a controversial person. He wants to become the President of the USA and though he has many followers (40% of the Republican voters) few think that he will ever be the POTUS. Hillary Clinton has better 'cards' (even though her time of birth is unknown*). Donald Trump is rich (so is Hillary, but he has more money than she has). Now let's see how this wealth is being mirrored by the chart in the whole-sign-house-system and in the Placidus house system.
SECOND HOUSE
Usually the second house is used to see how the finances are.
Donald Trump has ruler 10 in 12 in the whole-house-system and an empty 2nd house, even though with the 2nd lord in 12! Also, in the whole-sign-house-system transit Jupiter is in the 2nd house at the time of his bankruptcy!
In Placidus and in Porphyry he has Neptune and Jupiter in the 2nd house for the wealth (and for the bankruptcy on October 5, 1991). The 2nd house ruler is in 11 there. In Placidus the bankruptcy was with transit Mars exactly conjunct the 2nd house cusp. See the chart with transits and progressions for October 5, 1991 (first is the whole sign chart, the second one is for Placidus):
It might be, of course, that the whole house system rules and Donald Trump will give away all his money to charity and give up his ambitions (a 12th house idea). Otherwise, Now how about Hillary Clinton? It is hard to say, because her time of birth is a well kept secret. Astrologers are best off with the chart of Bill Gates, who has 2 planets (Jupiter and Pluto) in the 2nd house Placidus and even 3 in the whole-house-system, without relationships between 2 and 12. In the whole-sign-system Oprah's second house Placidus Sun, Mercury and Venus move over to the 3rd, leaving the 2nd house empty...
It is always like that with house systems. Even the whole house doesn't provide a full house! Or, could it be that the 2nd house is more about public performance than about wealth? Up to now the results seem to be in favor of the Placidus system and that means that I have to tolerate that Saturn in 7 of mine:).
Of course, planets in the 2nd house just give us information about public performance and what you have (talents or money). Ruler 2 in 12 might waste talent and money. Have I told you yet that my ruler 2 is in 10 in Placidus? I am not rich (yet:).
ELEVENTH HOUSE
There are astrologers who say that wealth and gain is in the 11th house,(http://www.astrologykrs.com/wealth-in-astrology.html here is an example)
In that case, in the whole-sign-house-system, lord of the 11th house is in 12 (Mercury) and there are planets in the 11th house in both systems for Donald Trump. The 12th house is a drain! Or is the 12th house media, too (all behind the screens?). In Placidus the lord of the 11th house is in 4 (real estate!).
Bill Gates has an empty 11th house, with it's ruler Venus in 5, conjunct Saturn. 5 is a lucky house and the house of entertainment, plays and games.
Oprah has Moon+Mars (Placidus) or Neptune (whole house) in 11 with ruler 11 in 3 always. The 3rd house is the house of talk-talk-talk.
MORE EXAMPLES
- Michael Schumacher has ruler 2 in 10 and Venus in the 11th house in Placidus, In whole-sign: empty 2 and 11, ruler 2 in 9.
- Dominique Strauss Kahn has ruler 2 and ruler 11 in 10, Mercury+Uranus in 11 and Saturn in 2 in Placidus. In whole-sign: rulers 2 and 11 in 10, empty 2nd house, Uranus in 11.
- Duchess of York Sarah has Jupiter ruler 2 in 2; Venus and Pluto in 11 and ruler 11 in 1 in whole-sign. In Placidus, Saturn is in the 2nd house and Venus in 11. Ruler 2 is in 1 and ruler 11 in ...12.
- Bernie Madoff had transit Saturn conjunct Placidus cusp 2 on December 10, 2008 (the day of his confession). His chart has an empty second house. Pluto, ruler 4 is in 11 and Neptune in 1. Ruler 2 in 9. Now the whole-sign-chart: Neptune in 2 and Mars in 11. Ruler 2 and 11 in 9. (Here you may choose which system is better:)
- Angelina Jolie has 2 in 11 and 11 in 12, an empty 2nd house and Sun+Mercury in 11 in Placidus. In the whole-sign chart we see both houses empty, with ruler 2 in 12.
The Placidus system generally seems to be a better tool to see how the finances are, no matter if you use the 2nd or 11th house to see what rich people have (2) or gain (11), but not always Maybe there is a reason why most astrologers prefer to use Placidus... Of course, this list doesn't contain enough examples to be sure. This try out of house systems is only valid if it is true that the 2nd and 11th house related to 10 offer better prospects for richness, than the 12th...And of course, it takes a whole chart and you need to know circumstances, too.
But I have the idea, that I have to stick to that Saturn in 7 (in an intercepted sign, maybe that 'helps') or that I continue to try to avoid houses. I am still not convinced. Maybe I should try other houses?
But I have the idea, that I have to stick to that Saturn in 7 (in an intercepted sign, maybe that 'helps') or that I continue to try to avoid houses. I am still not convinced. Maybe I should try other houses?
Do you use house rulers much? What system do you use and why do you think it is a good one? And where do you look for 'wealth' in a chart? Questions, questions...
LINKS
http://astropost.blogspot.nl/2015/04/bruce-jenner-uranus-and-porphyry-house.html (about the Porphyry system)
http://astropost.blogspot.nl/2015/08/progressed-moon-out-of-bounds-special.html About Hillary and Donald in 2016
EXTERNAL LINK
Article of Matthew Currie about 'whole signs' with the example chart of George Lucas.
